Brisket on the Kamado Joe

  • So, keen to hear your tips... I just can't quite get my brisket the way I'd like on my Classic Joe grill... It's the one cook that always leaves me a little frustrated! Always tastes great, but just not quite there... I will fully admit to being a perfectionist... and also to not being a BBQ expert at all!

    Some of the things I do:

    - Start with a ~1.5kg lump of brisket
    - Smoke at ~225F (usually hovers up to about 250F before I'll tweak the vents, but I try to aim for 225F)
    - Duration of cook dependent on temp of the meat - cook to around 200F then wrap to rest for a short while before carving (don't wrap during the cook as wanting to get a good bark and didn't really like the bark a few times I did wrap it!)
    - Water bath on the heat deflector, keep topped up during the cook (someone else with a Kamado I got talking to suggested this not long after I bought mine - I know in theory they say you don't need one in the kamados)
    - Have tried injecting recently, really didn't think it made that much difference in flavour (mix of beef stock and Worcestershire sauce)
    - Usually rub before it hits the grill and trim the fat to 1/4 before rubbing. Rub is usually a DIY mix of various spices, salt, etc. Usually will splash it down with a bit of Worcestershire sauce before rubbing to help the rub stick.

    The issues I get:
    - Minimal smoke ring. Flavour is there, but often negligible smoke ring present.
    - Drying through any thinner parts around the edges
    - I have had dryness throughout the meat but ONLY when I've used pretty poor quality brisket with minimal fat and haven't injected

    What I'm happy with:
    - Rub is giving some really nice flavour and a good bark over much of the brisket (as long as I don't wrap for too long after the cook and let it sweat! LOL!)
    - Usually - when using a good quality lump of brisket - will get fairly moist meat... BUT I think I may be over-cooking as it'll tend to break up a bit when I cut it (I also know my knives aren't great - they tend not to cut well through the bark so I end up tearing the meat a bit. I've been using an ordinary carving knife. Any knife suggestions?) Dry edges are nearly always an issue on any thin areas though.


    So... what are other people doing? What should I change? Should I try smoking unwrapped/wrap for a while/then back on the grill unwrapped to finish off the bark? Other advice...?

  • I'm no Brisket champion but I have learnt not to bother with anything less than 4kg. The small, 2kg or less are better braised, corned or rolled for pot roast. I go fairly consistent for more than a few hours with a light colour smoke from the bbq for a smoke ring. Some suggest putting the meat on cold for better penetration. I've never tried or felt the need.
    Others will probably give better advise.

    Sent from my electric phone using my finger.

    Jumbuck 7 burner with hood. Baby Weber kettle. 52" Kettle. Weber Go Anywhere. 5' SS Spit rotisserie. Offset smoker. Akorn Kamado. :) ASMOKE AS500N. Hibachi.:bbq:

  • Agree with Captain on the brisket size. If I am cooking for the family I tend to buy a Costco full packer. Separate the point from the flat and cut the flat in half. Ends up around 4kg each.

    Totally in my opinion 225 is too low. Try keeping the range between 250-275. I keep the water pan topped up during the first 5hrs of the cook (just enough to keep it steaming and allowed to run dry).
    1/4 inch fat is perfect, with the hotter temp this will cure the dryness issue :)
    Dont worry about smoke ring, if you want a proper one get a decent offset stick burner. My latest cook here. minimal smoke ring but it was ok. Smoke ring does not indicate nice smoke flavor and its not a competition (I think)
    Wrap during 160-180 stall not 200f. At 200f it way past and almost done
    Buy a Thermo pen and make sure all of the brisket is >203f and feels like delicious butter when probed.

    This is purely subjective. I am sure there are some more experienced guys here to add.

  • A few suggestions from my experiences, no specific order.

    Add a few chunks of wood to the lump if u want a better smoke ring. I find the kamado with lump only does not provide a big smoke ring as an offset/pellet grill does but thats appearance only.

    Use a bigger piece of meat. If its the flat i wouldnt bother unless its at least 3 inches thick. Anything thinner will dry out and crumble on the edges before it has had a chance to render properly. Even a thicker piece's first slice or 2 will be somewhat dry.

    Cook for feel NOT temp. Every piece of meat is different. Grab a skewer and start checking for doneness, will feel like a hot knife through butter. As a guide i start checking at at around 90c.

    Start meat uncovered until bark is set and then wrap. Once done you can unwrap for a bit to reset bark, i dont bother though.

    If the meat is dry it is usually a sign it hasnt rendered yet and needs more time. Resist the temptation to pull it off as you think it is over done.

    Cook meat early and wrap for longer. Dont cook late and not allow time for resting.

    Brisket doesnt need to be injected, cooked right it will have a great beef flavour and be moist.

    Always use the best quality meat u can and do not trim too much fat off. Cook fat side up.

    My possessions: GMG DB - Ziggy Triple

  • I can't add much to what has been said above. A 1.5kg brisket for me is for braising. I probably wouldn't do one under around 4.5kg, but thats my preference.

    If you really want a smoke ring, given its all cosmetic anyway use some curing salt.

    As for wanting to smoke smaller bits of meat I use chuck. I pretty much only cook briskets now for comps or comp pracrice.



    Traeger - Weber Family Q - Ziggy Twin Burner - Charcoal Grill - Akorn Kamado - Hark Tri Fire - Jumbuck Pizza Oven - Go Anywhere - Asmoke Pellet Grill - Hibachi Grill - Anova Sous Vide x 2

  • Similar to guys above I think the cut of meat and size is the issue rather than your process. I now only use the brisket ‘flats’ for curing and making pastrami due to the lack of fat in there. Even doing that it still needs a few hrs sous vide or steaming after smoking so it has a decent texture or can be unpleasantly dry.
    If you can get the brisket ‘point’ on its own or a full packer(flat and point joined together) and carry out the same process I’d be surprised if your result isn’t markedly better.
    Good luck!

  • I rarely get much smoke ring on the kamado's, period. I think its to do with the limited airflow. I can use the same fuel and smoke on a Weber kettle and get smoke ring so its something kamado related. As Wazza said you can cheat smoke ring with curing salts but be carefull, A little goes a long way with curing nitrates.
    As for the rest, I too don't bother smoking a Brisket under 5kg and it must be ox brisket, Aussie yearling just doesn't cook down the same. Then you need to deal with shielding the ends that hang over the deflector so they don't burn up. Its all doable but I just go for a different cue these days.
    Hope this helps and enjoy the journey

  • Hi

    Some parts of brisket will always be drier. Get a real nice sauce and serve as burnt ends with beer for a snack.

    I don't get the same smoke ring on a kamado as the Weber. Try getting a half to full fist size piece of Mallee root (or other super hard wood) flaming and put it on the top of the lit charcoal. It will smoke for 30 plus minutes once you close the lid and give you some smoke ring. I put smaller bits of jam wood in amongst the charcoal to give little puffs of smoke every now and then.

    I fully agree with crutching after the meat has stalled for an hour or so. I leave the meat wrapped in foil till the meat gets up to around 83c. After that I work on feel rather than temp.

    In comps we have found long rest time imperative. I wrap in foil and put in an esky for at least an hour. When we haven't allowed enough rest time we have not done well.

    When I crutch I sometimes put the meat in a large oven tray on a "cake rack". I put some wine or apple juice in the bottom. This will steam and reduce the dry end bits at least a little. I also spritz during unwrapped cooking on the thinner parts. This can be hard in a kamado as the large tray sometimes doesn't fit.

    I never cook the flat and point separately. They connective tissue between them seems to keep everything juicy. In comps we separate and carve separately. At home I leave it together to carve and serve.

    I know I do thinks a little differently at times. Hopefully this, together with everyone else's comments, gives you a few things to try.

    Ta

    Grant from Grass Valley (or from Aspen at this very moment).

    Weber Magnum, Old Weber Kettle, Weber Kettle with gas fitting, Weber Q320, Weber Go Anywhere, Akorn, Giotto ECM[size=12]

  • Some great info and advice here.
    I have successfully cooked several of the smaller pieces by braising. I have also tried one without braising, but wrapping early. It was ok, but not fantastic.
    Use the search function to find threads about braising.
    Like others, I also tend to not bother with the smaller briskets, and also the quality of the meat plays a big part in the finished product.

    Very effin UDS, GMG Daniel Boone Prime

  • Thanks everyone for the tips!

    So I think the main issue I have is cooking too small a piece of meat. Usually just doing a cook for hubby and myself so the idea of having 4kg or more of brisket on hand has put me off the bigger pieces! May have to give one a go when I'm cooking for others sometime. I did give up on the thin briskets I found at one butcher. So dry that it was worse than a dodgy RSL roast, LOL. I have successfully reheated BBQ left-overs in our steam oven if I've vacuum sealed them on the night I've cooked them. Its the only acceptable way I've found thus far that has resulted in anything like fresh! Would be keen to hear what others do and find works...

    I did forget to add that I usually do throw on ~3 pieces of some kind of smoking wood not long before I put the meat on (give it enough time to catch). For brisket I'm usually reaching for hickory or some red box wood I have... but it depends on what I have on hand if I'm running short of smoking wood.

    Oh, and the wrapping I mentioned was resting. Straight in the esky with a hot water bottle and a couple of towels to cuddle up to. ;) Will have to try to wrap again at the stall and watch the temp more closely now that I have the remote probe (though I'm not convinced it's showing me the correct temp... my other thermometer disagrees with it by ~10F and I'm not sure which one is correct!).


    A little off the original topic... but what would you recommend for smaller cuts instead of brisket that I can smoke low & slow... that is beef? Doesn't need to be an all-day cook by any means. Someone mentioned chuck... Will have to see if I can get a lump of that from anywhere (I often buy it sliced and grind it for burgers but hadn't thought about doing a lump of it on the smoke!).

  • A brisket that small will likely just be a piece of the flat, so you will struggle with that.

    I always use a waterpan in my Big Green Egg, the more you can increase the humidity the more dissolved smoke will settle on the meat and the “closer” the heat is to the meat.

    Wrapping will help the meat travel through the stall and help keep it moist, just unwrap and let the bark dry off for the last hour or so.

    Smoke ring is a Myth.
    "Smoke ring" is not a product of smoke, it is a ring of cured meat.
    This ring of cured meat comes from the nitrates in the fumes from the fire, curing the outer layer of the meat, setting the colour, like in a ham.
    Wood contains large amounts of nitrogen (N). When wood burns, the nitrogen in the wood bonds with oxygen (O) in the air to form nitrogen dioxide (NO2). This Nitrogen dioxide is highly water-soluble, and dissolves in the moisture on the outside of the meat to form nitrous acid. The “Smoke Ring” is created when nitrous acid is absorbed into the outer layers of the meat, this sets the pigment Myoglobin to give the distinctive red ring.

    You can cheat a "smoke ring" in your oven (without smoke) if you rub the meat with nitrate.
    Heatbeads and most briquette fuel are formulated to produce nitrates for this reason. The smoke is there for flavour and you don't need any more than a few Banksia cones or wood blocks to get enough smoke.

    NO2 is a combustion by-product when natural gas or propane is burned and so cooking with gas will also produce a distinctive “Smoke Ring” under the right conditions.

    The issue for Kamado users is that charcoal already has a lot of the Nitrogen driven out, so you will struggle to get a smoke ring, you’ll get smoke flavour but the red ring where the pigment has been set is often elusive. You can try loading the smoke up at the start of the cook but there is a risk you will deposit too much acrid smoke (Creasote) onto the surface of the meat. Remember also that Smoke penetration or adherence happens best when the meat is cold, some people will freeze the brisket for an hour or so before cooking, once the surface gets to 65ish °C (149°F) the smoke adhesion drops considerably.

    If you are addicted to the smoke ring, cheat! Try using a tiny amount of nitrate cure in your rub. Celery juice contains a natural nitrate (great for curing a natural bacon), try making a paste from Vegemite and celery juice. Slather it onto the brisket and then apply your rub on top of that. You can also inject a thinner mix of Celery juice and Vegemite, the Sodium and Potassium Salts will denature the proteins and modify them to hold more moisture, this will minimise moisture loss. Do your injection and Slather the day before to allow time for the magic to happen.

  • chuck, blade, cheeks or shorties would be my choices for low n slow beef

    How could I forget cheeks! I'm cooking up a few cheeks this weekend. Have done them once before and I'll never go back to doing them in the slow cooker. ;)

    I've done some Cape Grim shorties and they were amazing. Cheaper ones I've got my hands on have been hit or miss. Usually taste OK, but not always great texture.

    Smoke ring is a Myth.
    "Smoke ring" is not a product of smoke, it is a ring of cured meat.
    This ring of cured meat comes from the nitrates in the fumes from the fire, curing the outer layer of the meat, setting the colour, like in a ham.
    Wood contains large amounts of nitrogen (N). When wood burns, the nitrogen in the wood bonds with oxygen (O) in the air to form nitrogen dioxide (NO2). This Nitrogen dioxide is highly water-soluble, and dissolves in the moisture on the outside of the meat to form nitrous acid. The “Smoke Ring” is created when nitrous acid is absorbed into the outer layers of the meat, this sets the pigment Myoglobin to give the distinctive red ring.


    I had read that on one of the BBQ pages... and it makes sense when you think of the biochemistry/chemistry happening behind the scenes! Thank you for reminding me of this.

    Part of me is considering giving up on the "smoke ring" completely as long as I hit the flavour. The only thing is when you cook for other people they seem to expect it "or its not real BBQ". I've been considering getting my hands on some curing salt to make up some bacon, so I could always add a little to my rub when I'm cooking for other people! ;) Not really worth cheating when just cooking for myself as I care more about flavour and texture than I do aesthetics. I'm not comp cooking!

  • I've vacuum sealed them on the night I've cooked them. Its the only acceptable way I've found thus far that has resulted in anything like fresh! Would be keen to hear what others do and find works...

    I'm usually pretty happy with the microwave. I've also been happy using the sous vide to reheat vac sealed goodies.

    Masterbuilt Gravity 800 | Maximus Pizza Oven | GMG - Daniel Boone | Cyprus Grill | Big Steel Keg | Blackstone Griddle | Fire Pit | Weber Genesis |

  • I'm usually pretty happy with the microwave. I've also been happy using the sous vide to reheat vac sealed goodies.

    I'm with Narm on this one. Vac seal, the re-heat in the microwave.
    A smaller cut, if you can get it is Brahman hump. I've only done it once, but found it similar to brisket. It was around the 2kg mark from memory.
    Hump Day

    Very effin UDS, GMG Daniel Boone Prime

  • I sous vide meat that is cooked to a low temp like tri tip when reheating. With the high temp cuts like brisket or pulled pork I wrap them in alfoil, add some apple juice then seal it up and let it come upon to temp very slowly. I reckon it comes out as good as when fresh.

    We all have our ways :huh:

    Ta

    Grant from Grass Valley

    Weber Magnum, Old Weber Kettle, Weber Kettle with gas fitting, Weber Q320, Weber Go Anywhere, Akorn, Giotto ECM[size=12]

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